Everton Banter Archive May 09 2015

09 May 2015 22:04:44
Not sure what Barkley done to think today was all his fault. I think there was one moment where he kept the ball too long and lost it.

In an attacking sense he help contribute with the other attacking players 22 shots today in what was one of the strangest games I've seen at goodison for a while. You lot who moan about him but are the ones putting him on the pedestal.

I remember a boxing day game I think against Sheff Wed. We battered them for 90 mins but they broke away and scored 4 goals!

For me Stones was at fault for the goal for . holding onto the ball too much and the other goal was a complete freak.

I'm not so hysterical about todays game as others. I thought we played well in the second half but in front of goal we were awful.

I've already given up on this season. Fair play to Sunderland they needed the points and I remember us playing games like that in the 90s. Good luck to em.

09 May 2015 22:17:34
Oh yeah, the people calling him overrated and crap are the ones calling him world class and the people calling him world class are the ones calling him overrated and crap, wait what?. He only lost it once? Haha come on take your ross tinted glasses off.

{Ed025's Note - i like that swan..

09 May 2015 23:00:58
Its more that you in particular have anegative outlook on the player that is highly over exaggerated.

I suggest a course of prozac would be in order for you.

I am saying that people like yourself have an expectation of him being or becoming world class. i'm more looking at him as a good midfielder with potential and when we were playing well as a team he played a key part in that.

He is not making the team struggle, the team is struggling and him along with it.

I don't see how you can blame him for today. Lukaku was poor, mirallas came on and done his usual thing of ignoring his team mates, lennon looked like he had taken lessons off mcGeadey and Stones went back to making his usual mistakes. These were more glaring and contributed more to the result than Barkleys performance.

Now go get your prozac from the chemist.

{Ed025's Note - thts a fair point john..

10 May 2015 01:58:47
I don't have any expectations, What I expect from an everton player and apparant everton fan is a few things, 1. Give everything (he doesnt) 2. Try to keep the ball (he doesnt) 3. If your teammate makes a good run then give him the ball (he doesn't or, cant) and 4. don't hog the ball and want the glory all for yourself (he does). Do I want him to be world class? Of course, I also want mcgeady, osman and howard to be world class, sadly, for all 4, they are a long long long long way off. Casing point, a young lad for newcastle, adam armstrong, only 17, went clear through on his debut vs sunderland and despite pappis cisse being in a better position, the local lad, for his boyhood club, he shot. After realizing that he should of passed it, he looked gutted, he was 17 and already knew that he made the wrong decision. Ross barkley is 21 and makes the wrong decision a few times every game, does he look arsed? Nah. He couldn't give two stuffs, as long as he looks good on the tele he's living the dream. Its not people having expectations, its him, he doesn't want to improve, he doesn't have the hunger.

10 May 2015 08:35:24
I suppose that's the difference between your view and mine then. I believe he does care as when he was struggling earlier this season you could see the look on his face and the fear of failure. That pressure of failure got to him and his confidence evaporated. He is still trying to get that back.

Not sure what comparison a 17 yo from Newcastle on his debut is as Barkley has first made his in 2011 so its not exactly a fair comparison. But what I will say is that Barkley will always try and find player and try those passes that hardly come off. The pass for Lukaku on the pen spot is a perfect example. Not many would try it and even less would find him but he did.

Whether you're 17 or 21, 2 full seasons at either age is still very young and very early in a carear. He will get better and make better decisions, dribbles, passes and develop in his trade and remember he has a manager that wants to develop with a spanish mentality which, in his position is to not chase and get back but to play with arrogance and always want the ball in the advanced positions.

As for looking gutted because he made the wrong choice, I think your 17 yo is the only one in world football that would look arsed.

10 May 2015 09:44:02
Have to agree with you BlueJohnUns Barkley should not be running round chasing the ball he should be in the advanced positions waiting for the turnover in possession surely that's why we play with both Barry and Mccarthy? Mirrallas probably lost the ball more times in the short time that he was on but god forbid give him any stick same goes for Lukaku who not once actually got in between the space between the 2 Sunderland centre halfs to allow Barkley to play a through ball. I am sure a regular poster just likes to come and single out players for criticism rather than the team as a whole. John Stones for example was bullied by Danny Graham and was at best average yesterday he was caught in possession a few times in advanced positions which then left us exposed at the back but I haven't seen many posters criticising him? I have said it before and will say it again Ross Barkley should be played behind Lukaku and once Lukakus hold up play improves I then believe they will both improve and cause defenders problems. Ross has a go and doesn't jog back from offside positions like our recordsigning.Who doesn't look bothered does. but again he doesn't come in for criticism.

10 May 2015 15:32:24
Haha, barkley is being played behind lukaku and is playing terrible. 'when lukaku's hold up play improves' so barkley cannot be good until another player becomes good? that's a bad excuse. Also, stones had one bad game, unlucky, barkley's had about 50x that many, but god forbid anyone has a go. i'm not suprised lukaku walks back onside, he has plenty of time too while barkley runs around in a circle. Mccarthy has shown this season he can go forward and i'd have him there over barkley. Also, john, barkley has been on loan and played a few games under moyes, he's making the same mistakes at 21 he was making at 17, that's really really bad. Ruud gullit mentioned barkley shouldn't be tracking back, but if at the age of 21 you're knackered after an hour, after making 2 tackles, then you have big problems. Lukaku has 19 goals this season, barkley has 2 assists in 4 years. Is it any wonder lukaku tries to do things himself?. Also, about barkley caring, you would think he would leave penalties to, well, penalty takers. he's miles behind were garrard and rooney were at his age and I guarantee you next season he is exactly the same player. We should cash in while we can. Get a player who will actually support the striker, that's another thing, how often does it look like we play a 4-5-1 formation because barkley drops back and leaves lukaku on his own against 5 players? People moan about him being played out of psotion, erm, he thinks he's a sweeper most of the time! Trying to act all elegant on the ball like he can control a game like a paul scholes or andrea pirlo when he simply lacks the ability tk do so.

10 May 2015 16:32:08
Stones has had a lot more than one bad game this season but am not lambasting him for It as he is learning the game in a top league as is Ross. You have your opinion swan and I have mine, I do believe he is a victim of the managers poor tactics and he tries to hard when losing the ball due to fans getting on his back all the time, he is then merely trying to impress instead of concentrating on his game. I don't believe in comparing players to validate an argument as it just comes across as petulent it is what it is and he is a young professional learning the game which in his position is all about discipline and positional play. Surely the manager should be playing the shape in training in order for him and Lukaku to get an understanding? If you want a scapegoat look to the touchline at the conman in the coat its his tactics that have destroyed one of the best group of players I have seen in my lifetime.

10 May 2015 19:23:26
it seems a war of words has broken out hand out the tin hats I agree with both of you lads certain players get a volley of fire and others can do no wrong about stones he plays the way everybody wants but it seems that when a mistake is made it most of the time is converted by the opposition it seems to me that he didn't see garbutt or garbutt didn't ask for the ball so why not knock it out for a throw in take the safety first option now about barkley were do start a player who runs looking at his feet dosent look up and his awareness of men around him is zero he runs into trouble time after time dosent track back and tries the hollywood ball or attempted pass almost on a regular basis but is it that other players are happy to let him have it and don't want the responsability during the game or is napoleon giving out orders before games that he has almost no position to occupy just to float were he wants also boys can anybody explain these redicolous flip charts when a substitution is made are players so thick they have to be told what to do when they go on by showing them matchstick men on paper surely when you go on a game is constantly changing so what the hell is the point of that nonsense you only see graham jones are assistant manager when a sub is made earning his money showing emptyhead players ls lowery drawings hope I have helped a ceasefire as yours and my love for the blues shines through on these pages thanks ed

{Ed025's Note - cheers al..good post mate, and lets try and stop the pettiness guys we are all on the same side for christs sake..

10 May 2015 20:11:41
No war of words from me fellas just a difference of opinion that is all maybe am right maybe am wrong only time will tell my point was no matter who pulls on that jersey I will get behind them through the good times and bad and won't lambast them from the stands. The manager on the other hand well that's a different story I blame him and his one dimensional ideas for ruining good players and absolutely killing the atmosphere at Goodison in the process.

{Ed025's Note - thats fair imo gray..

11 May 2015 06:50:54
Don't worry lads. I will put a post on and Swan will leave you lot alone for a while. I must have put 150 posts on in the last couple of years and according to Swan.every point I have made is wrong. Actually, he will come on and say I put 151 posts on and 152 of them were wrong! lol

11 May 2015 09:23:02
Its all a matter if opinion degsy and if we all agreed it would be quite boring. The banter shows we have passion for our club and want what's best. Some say its best to drop Barkley some say he will be a top player its all about opinion I don't get heated or agitated in stating my point of view and if am wrong I will hold my hands up but that won't stop me airing my views.

09 May 2015 20:19:19
Look at the young talent we have to nurture. Barkley, stones, garbutt, besic, lukaku and Mccarthy. Now look at who is entrusted with this job. Martinez. These players need a strong character to praise them when they are doing good but not be afraid to drop them to protect them when they aren't playing well. Roberto has hyped Barkley up yet doesn't know were his best position is, he has said Lukaku is one of the best? Sorry Benteke looks a lot better and looks like he will be a lot better. He killed Stones confidence by playing Alcaraz before him he won't drop Baines when its clear his positioning and set pieces have disappeared Barry before Besic?. We are in danger of losing all our youngsters with potential whilst this man is in charge. Barkley needs discipline in what position he is playing in, in order to progress and Lukaku needs to practice his first touch and headers but the manager doesn't see this he sees 2 phenomenal players with potential. Sorry but the style of play comes from the boss and it doesn't suit the players we have we need to play to our potential, lose the 2 holding midfielders let besic sit in front of the back 4 let Mccarthy be our box to box player free our fullbacks to go forward and overlap with the wingers and get some balls in the box for the centre forward and play ross behind the striker. I am bored watching us go backwards and sideways with no urgency and teams just sitting deep because they know we won't run at them with pace. Sorry for the rant but this man has to go before we lose the best group of youngsters we have had in a long time

09 May 2015 18:07:15
Im not saying we were awful today, because pretty football was played all over the place bar the 18yd box. Here there n everywhere, but our crosses and passes into the box are woeful and when they do get through its up n over or a pass to the keeper. There was 2 frauds out there which really let us all dowm, Lukaku and Barkley. Lukaku, wants to be the best in the World, Martinez virtually says he is. Well he made it clear in the first 5 minutes where his attitude was heading, 4 abysmal simple passes to the opposition and it didn't get better. Even when clear on goal, just no conviction, and at times downright lazy!! Barkley flatters to deceive, all silky skills going round n round, sideways but ultimately going nowhere! Where are his shots on goals we are all told of, he played in a good role for him today but did he ever look like having a shot of note?! one measley one straight at the keeper and what's even more worrying, he caant do 90 mins. We all know Ossie can't so its why people get on his back, but he does more useful things in 90 mins than Barkley does and has plenty of attempts at goal. Its shocking to see a 21 yo treading water after 65 mins, at times falling over his feet, for once the 21yo bit really has no place here, he should be ready for another 90 mins at that age and its not like he's been overplayed this Season. Like everyone has said, he's no super star in the making, we can all see it, you know when its someone special because there is a hunger in them a bit of devil, its not there with Barkley, he is just a silky footballer who doesn't know how to lead a game and looks to everyone else to do the leading with him just a periphery to the game.

09 May 2015 19:38:09
Some good points there Howie. I will try and be objective here and put my own slant on it without being too emotional. Firstly, RM seems to have his favourites like all managers. Unfortunately Barkley seems to be one of them. I know I am repeating myself, but he signs players who statistics show score few goals. The one exception being Lukaku. I personally thing too much is expected of Lukaku re goals. I have pointed out many times that the majority of our goals have come from Lukaku, Mirallas, Naismith and our full backs. Players like McCarthy, Barry, Besic, Lennon, McGeady and Kone statistically score very few goals. When RM loads the team with these players, the emphasis is that Lukaku must score or we don't win. Or very rarely win. I don't know the exact total, but the list above have probably scored less than 7 goals in total in ALL their games with Everton. I can hear the comments from certain posters now about injuries. blah blah blah. but that list of players have probably played about 200 games for us and scored less than 7 goals. Maybe someone can be arsed to check? Anyway, Lukaku has too much expectation and must be pretty easy to double up on with defenders to nullify his effectiveness. Then you have stopped Everton. For this reason alone, I would nearly always have Naismith and Mirallas in the team. Just because they both score a few goals. In the past Osman would be in this category too, but he is now slowing down and although can still pass a cutting ball through, hardly ever gets in a scoring position. If we lose Lukaku through transfer or injury, in my humble opinion, we are in big pooh. We need 6 or 7 new young players who can contribute goals. I said this last season and was ridiculed. (as I often am for putting through my honest assessment)I really fear for us. I see a good young up and coming player in Barkley who is a good sub to throw on with 20 mins to go playing 90 minutes and in positions that are not his natural. He has the odd good game but overall looks like a little boy lost. Both Mirallas and Naismith should be in the team ahead of him. Or try him up front with Lukaku in a 442 set up. That was another one I got ridiculed for. Not that I am paranoid or anything. My assessment is big worries for us. I just don't see how we can bring more goals to the squad and I hear discontent re Distin, Eto'o and others. I think RM lost the teams support earlier and has done well to recover. But like I said before, we were playing much better football 2 seasons ago with both our full backs being used as overlapping wing backs whipping in super crosses. Our tactics now are not effective for Baines or Coleman overlapping. The slow build up allows the opposition to get 2 defenders on the wings and nullify this type of football. We do get lots of possession. 22 shots today. 4 on target.wow. I wonder if that shows what I am saying? Plaayers like Mirallas who has a wonderful shot or Naismith who works his socks off and is probably our best header of the ball both on the bench. Lennon was good for a couple of games.but like I said.why to Spurs want rid? They are not stupid. McGeady was a terrible signing. Kone was. Barry and McCarthy will never score more than 3 a season between them. To me the future looks bleak. Sorry to be so negative, but that's how I see it. Have done for a while. Last point which I made in a previous post. we can't even beat the bottom teams any more. A few lucky wins this season has put us in a false position. We are actually higher than we should be.

09 May 2015 19:48:10
Nail on the head howie yet only Barkley comes in for stick. We didn't pay nearly 30 million for Barkley that's the difference. Lukaku got put in the pocket of Coates yes that's right the same awful centre half that got shipped out by our neighbours. Tbh what has he actually done this season that makes you stand up and think ay this fella is the real deal and worth what we paid? He doesn't bully defenders he doesn't stretch defences with his movement and he can't win a header. Never mind if a big offer comes in for Ross I'd take anything we can get for Rom.

09 May 2015 20:59:47
Barry got 3 goals last season and mccarthy got 1, that's 4 in total, 1 more than 3, unlucky.

10 May 2015 06:41:19
I knew you would come back with an alternative statistic Swan. But I had counted in those 4 goals in my total sum. Yes you are right. 4 from them two. Besic has scored how many? Lennon has scored how many? McGeady has scored how many? Kone has scored how many?.like I say, probably 200 games between them and less than 7 games. If you are just going to be argumentative for the silly sake of it, I won't bother answering your posts any more. But on this one, I did notice something about football once. If your team scores less goals than the opposition, then you sometimes lose games. I was very surprised when I realised this. Like I said previously. Less than 7 goals in 200 odd games is not enough from the midfield and forwards. It leaves too much responsibility on Lukaku. We need to sign and play players who score goals. It is very simple. Naismith and Mirallas should be in the team every week ahead of Barkley, Lennon, Kone, McGeady and even perhaps one of Barry and McCarthy.

{Ed025's Note - i agree we need more goals from midfield degsy, mcarthy needs to be in the side though mate, its all about balance..

10 May 2015 16:39:21
Degsy doesn't believe in balance ed, just sign strikers and stick them in every position, that will win games!

10 May 2015 21:41:17
Thanks for telling me what I believe in mate. I wasn't sure on that one either. Surely scoring goals is about balance? That's what I was saying. We could include Mirallas, Naismith and McCarthy. But then why play Barry, McGeady, Lennon or Kone? Anyway, whatever I say, Swan will disagree.

10 May 2015 23:00:18
Hey you told me what players I believed where going to be quality so i'm just returning the favour. didn't understand the middle of the post, the whole 'we could include' and 'why play barrt' etc, don't know what you're on about. The last bit is true, mainly because what you say can be summed up to 3 seperate things, your posts are 1. About what a messiah osman is, 2. What a messiah moyes is, or 3. Players who don't score goals aren't good enough. I disagree with all 3 so yeah I agree on the last part, hey we agreed.

11 May 2015 17:52:07
Lol with all the negativity on here lately ed I do enjoy degs and swans banter makes me laugh every time

{Ed025's Note - they are both great posters coby...but need to spend a bit of time on the naughty step mate.. :)

09 May 2015 17:53:45
I would say its time to let Barkley go. BUT. Aaron Ramsey always springs to mind. If Ross had a stronger character to look at (Someone much more Moyes Esque than RM), then I think he'd be in a better frame of mind. But unfortunately, RM has Arse(nal) Kissed him throughout the season, and you can see that he lacks discipline (AND STAMINA BY TODAYS GAME).

I dunno anymore. Very low morale atm. Just going to hope we don't get Europe next season, as it is clear that the Owners do not want to invest as much to keep us in contention at the top. Hope we Offload the rubbish and bring in a few key players to focus on the league and a cup wouldn't go amiss either.

Ayew, Winston Reid and Pato would be nice. AND they're all free.(Well so to speak.)

09 May 2015 18:59:14
Yes as we all know barkley should look up to a character like david moyes! You know! A character who doesn't play him! that's how to make young players good, don't play them, genius. Also, pato? Really? he's more injury prone than rodwell and can't finish.

09 May 2015 21:40:42
Alright Swan, hope your okay.

I beleive I should have expanded upon the point when I said Moyes esque. I meant someone who was no nonsence, and wouldn't take any crap for the players. Moyes for all his faults, was very much a Sergeant Major when it came to the team. He accepted no silly buisness, and knew how to keep pre madona's in line. And if you weren't performing you were dropped. RM is more Pally pally, and that gets on my nerves.

Also, yes Pato. How the heck do you know he can't finish? Do you watch him on the reg? Nah mate. sit down and breath for a bit.

09 May 2015 22:20:08
I watched him when he was the 'next big thing' at milan and he couldn't finish at all, also, his injury probems? Hello?.

10 May 2015 01:42:46
Pato Milan stats:
07/08 18 apps 9 goals. 08/09 36 apps 15 goals. 09/10 23 apps 15 goals. 10/11 25 apps 14 goals. 11/12 11 apps 1 goal. 12/13 4 apps 0 goals. League totals: 117 apps 51 goals.
He could finish back in the day but, as you say Swan, he is injury prone

10 May 2015 11:07:06
He was a teenager when dubbed the next big thing. And for a teen, his stats were pretty good for a goal scorer. You talk out your arse sometime swan.

10 May 2015 16:40:35
Yes obviously, there aren't too many 30 year old players being dubbed the next big thing.

09 May 2015 16:01:08
Anybody else see the sun loungers because our players are definitely already on there holidays.

{Ed025's Note - it looks that way gray, we were playing for pride today...but it appears we have none mate..

09 May 2015 21:27:23
I bought sun lounger off the Sunderland goalie who had a nice tan after his quietest afternoon of the season

09 May 2015 14:46:34
Now will u get rid of the connman

09 May 2015 12:08:56
I don't think Europe had anything to do with our poor league form.I actually looked forward to it we played our best football init teams in the Prem were working us out and Europe gave us great performances Wolfsburg home and away Young boys and Kiev at home .Infact I would say we only went out due to bad tactics away and even poorer team selection Alcatraz instead of stones or even Distin cost us major.In the league a bad start were we never won a game until Villa was bad but not as bad as our lowest point which was the crap we played over Xmas from early Dec against Stoke until Hull in late Jan we were awful . It was terrible to watch individual errors inept defending from set pieces and poor form in front of goal made this one of the hardest times to watch Everton in recent years.its here were I believe if we had gone out of Europe Rm would have been down the road it bought him the time to steady the ship and bring in Lennon who I was sceptical at first about but who has won me over in recent weeks will make a good addition to the squad .So it looks like Rm will start next season and he has got a big summer ahead who knows who he will go for but he must try and raise the standard of his transfers Mceady Kone Alcatraz Atsu all lazy signings and not good enough for Everton .I hope he gets it right but have a feeling he won't be manageing us at the end of next season.So yes I would like another go at Eurpoe if offered as iam sure would the traveling army of blues who followed us as good times are always had.

{Ed025's Note - they are fair points Am8, good post mate..