Everton Banter Archive August 17 2011

17 Aug 2011 22:28:56
leicester have lost again tonight, which hopefully means they will come back in for the yak asap do us a favour and hurry up sven {Ed025's Note - i second that..

17 Aug 2011 21:51:37
Totally agree with every single comment here, me and my brother are season ticket holder's (sadly not this season) and us and everyone around us were pulling our hair out at how deep arteta was playing even when fellaini was partnering him in CM arteta was sitting deep asking for the ball from full backs which could only be a tactic deployed by moyes.

The season before when he came back from injury i remember him getting forward and he was scoring goals and setting up chances for striker's so we all expected the same last season but the opposite happened, he sat deep wanted to receive the ball and then just laying it off 5-10 yards which we were all confused about.

It seemed to take moyes most of the season to decide to ask him to attack, and when he did against newcastle asking him to play on the left he was immense causing newcastle massive problems, but then being an evertonian the inevitable happened and he got injured

I hope moyes is more attacking this season, he tried to justify his defensive approach last season by saying it has worked in the past for us, but that's exactly what it is the PAST. Things move on, teams learn how to play against us, (isolate our lone striker) and man mark arteta and prevent baines getting forward.

Although it sounds like i am complaining about moyes, i am not, he's terrific and has done wonder's for us with a useless board behind him but i think he needs to stop being stubborn and play 4-4-2 and move forward and realise that teams have our number and know how to beat us, when we played 4-4-2 last season, i think it was 3 times on the spin in january and we looked a different side, we beat spurs 2-1, beat Scunthorpe 5-1, drew with liverpool 2-2 we were creating chances ans scoring goals, then all of a sudden at a home game against west ham we went back to 4-5-1 and drew 1-1 creating nothing and beckford looked lost again, it was strange.

Hopefully things change this season because i agree with what you said about player's getting played out of position.
Honestly a striker and a winger would complete our team and we would be right up there challenging europe, although we are a bit depressed at the minute, we actually have a very talented team of player's, the top 4 clubs would love to have a cahill, arteta, baines and fellaini amongst the youngster's we produce, we are so close to being a top side its frustrating, its such a shame that investors can't see our potential and our put off by our stadium, goodison is amazing in my eyes, but i took my little brother the villareal friendly last week ( his first game) and when he saw the the stadium he said "it looks like a factory" haha which sums it up, if a 8 year old thinks that imagine what a potential investor would think when first seeing the outside of it. {Ed025's Note - good post mate..

17 Aug 2011 19:36:04
Mikel Arteta.The best little Spaniard we know.The first name on the fantasy football teamsheet.Before last season, anyway. Yes, it all went a little bit wrong for Mikel in 10/11. After returning from a horrendous injury early in 2010, he was in sensational form, bagging 6 crucial goals and a couple of assists in just 13 starts. We went into the summer praying he'd sign a new deal. And he did. We celebrated his lengthy contract 'like a new signing'. We hypothesised how he and Fellaini would form the greatest CM pairing in the league; how the former would dominate the opposition while Arteta orchestrated our incisive, attacking play. This was going to be our year.It didn't quite happen though, in the end. We started slowly -- some might say we didn't start at all -- and Arteta and Fellaini were asynchronous; the very opposite of the cohesive, complimentary unit we all envisioned. Wishful thinking is definitely part of being a modern day Evertonian, and this looked to be the case again here. The worst part of it all though, is that it didn't make sense. It still doesn't, to be frank. Fellaini is a behemoth in the centre, and one of the most influential defensive players I've ever seen. Arteta is similarly influential in an offensive manner. So why didn't they gel? It always seemed to me that Arteta sat deeper than Fellaini, in a role more akin to that of his old mentor; Pep Guardiola. But surely that's a criminal waste of his talents? By playing him so deep he was closer to our goal than the opposition's, and it's not like we didn't need his vision and incisive passing. We couldn't score for toffee, so to speak, and seeing our best creative force collecting the ball from defenders before laying it off to someone else at the halfway line, well, it was enough to make you tear your hair out.
Eventually Moyes changed Arteta's position; giving him a new role, as our left sided midfielder. We all knew he was capable on the right flank, as he spent a few seasons out there for us earlier in his career, to head-turning effect. And before injury yet again curtailed his season, he was excellent on the left as well. He looked invigorated, with less defensive responsibilities and more freedom to leave an impression on the game, he came to life. The Sunderland victory comes to mind, where he skipped past opposition defenders like they were little more than training cones, before sliding the ball to Beckford to tap home. So why not just keep him at left midfield, I hear you ask. Well, contrived imaginary voice, I'll tell you why. His brief but positive performances out wide showed us that he could be influential from a wide position, true. But beyond that, they showed us he could still be influential in general. He hadn't changed as a player, he'd just seemingly had his role in the team changed. I believe he's best in the centre, because he's just a supremely talented footballer, and in the centre he becomes the literal and functional core of our team. He can do so much more damage. The problem for me is Fellaini. Or rather, their partnership. For Arteta to get back to his best, he needs to be allowed to occupy a more offensive position. He needs to be more advanced than his central partner. In the past this wasn't a problem, as under David Moyes we have traditionally played with an out and out defensive midfielder. In Marouane Fellaini we have a more complete player. Someone who wants to get forward more. And as useful as he is in the last third of the pitch, he's not as useful as Arteta. I believe this partnership can flourish, but to do so Fellaini must restrict his offensive role. Arteta needs to be our midfield maestro, and Fellaini our midfield warrior. Last season these roles reversed and I pray this does not persist.Of course it would be naive to think this was the only problem, or that it will be the only problem. We as a team have glaring flaws; a lack of pace, an over-reliance on our left flank and a questionable strikeforce. But there are things within the team that can change to improve our dynamic. This is one of them. Arguably, it's the most crucial thing. If we can get Mikel Arteta and Marouane Fellaini to function as one unit, then we will genuinely have the greatest centre midfield pairing in the whole of England. And that's without even mentioning Ross Barkley. Holy trinity, anyone?
Wishful thinking this may all be, but these days we have to construct our own positivity when it comes to Everton. Because she is a cruel mistress, and this summer has been a barren one on more than one front. With no incomings at all, a poor pre-season campaign and the now clichéd list of injuries starting to grow, there are a lot of things we don't have. But it would serve us all well to remember one thing: we still have Mikel Arteta, and he's the best little Spaniard we know. {Ed025's Note - WOW! and i thought war and peace was long winded!....excellent article mate

If Arteta plays CM again this year it'll be a farce.
He is by far and away a better left or right midfielder then he is central.
I'm starting to think Moyes just loves playing people out of position.
He plays Rodwell and Heitinga as DM/CM not CB, Annichebe wide on the right yet hardly upfront, Tim Cahill is a striker, plays there for Australia and kills it, yet Moyes continually deploys him deeper.
He has already starting doing it with Barkley, playing him wide when the kid should be sitting central. Last yr he even started Rodwell at right mid.
Spent close to 9 mil on Bilyaletdinov and still isn't sure what his best position is.
Its getting ridiculous. Round must be a yes man.

Spot on about Fellaini's and Arteta's roles. Arteta simply must be given offensive duty by Moyes this season, Fellaini to do the battling and defensive shift.

Good article. Agree with all of it. Though we are so short of decent wide players especially after Pienaar's departure, that I fear you may be disappointed in your wish to see him in his best position.

I'm hoping for a big season from Mikel. I think he'll interchange between left and central positions depending on the game and injuries we pick up. I was up for making him our full time left midfielder at one point, given our lack of creativity, but the emergence of Barkley has changed things a little on that front. We could either use Osman and Fellaini in the middle with Arteta to the left of them or Barkley on the left and Arteta alongside Fellaini. Both options look good to me. {Ed025's Note - and me...nice post..

Mikel makes things happen when he plays well for us. He is one of our most creative players and we saw it against sunderland and newcastle before he got injured again last season. Mikel at his best is something special. I hope he has a good season

Still love Mikky. Hope he's back to his best this year.

Arteta in the middle only works with a true defensive mid like Neville or Carsley. Why? Because Mikel will always try to come deep to take the ball from the centre backs. There needs to be someone disciplined there to usher him forward. ie not Mofro.But Fellaini is far too good to leave out, therefore Mikel should play on the left IMO. He can do everything Pienaar could do, but with a better final ball. I predict a massive season for him

Good post
Out wide seems to be the best place for him at the moment. Thing is, he's pretty deadly from the area around the edge of the box, too, both passing and shooting. I think Rodwell-Fellaini-Barkley is probably the future for the centre though. I hope Jack finds a settled position this season.

I couldn't agree more with what you said about the dynamics of the ArtetaFellaini partnership in central midfield. Arteta was playing too deep. He has better playmaking skillstricks than Fellaini but was having to stay deep and cover for him way too much, when it should have been the other way around.

We dominated most teams we played in terms posession last season. ArtetaFellaini are both great at passing and holding on to the ball, while not giving it away cheaply, unlike alot of Premiership teams. The problem we suffered from most was having little quality down the flanks and only 1 striker upfront.

I'd agree with your solution about keeping both players in central midfield, just swapping their roles, if we had good cover down the flanks, but we don't. One thing we do have though is an abundance of good central midfielders. I'd shift Arteta out on to the wing and use other players such as HeittingaRodwellOsmanBarkleyBilyetdinov in the centre.

I think Bilyetdinov is actually a talented player and needs to be given a chance in an attackingcentral role, which I think he's more suited to, due to his lack of pace, because he's technically good imo, he's just low on confidence because Moyes has never given him a good run in the team.

Our team, with the right players selected, is good enough to control most games in the midfield. Our defensive record last year was really good, we didn't concede considerably more than the big teams in the league, which given our poor start to the season was impressive. We just struggle to score due to the lack of quality on the wings but mostly due to only having 1 striker playing upfront on his own. I really felt sorry for Beckford when he was that lone striker as you can tell it's not his natural game. He's always played with another striker alongside him. Cahill doesn't get high enough up to support him when we're attacking so he has to try and hold the ball up, which isn't what his game's about. He needs balls infront of him so he can make the most of his pace and finishing. SahaBeckford should be our strike partnership. Sadly I don't think Moyes will play 2 upfront.

*whiteshadow*

17 Aug 2011 15:50:36
I think we should get Pedro leon and vicente on loan for our wing positions and with the sale of yak 3m,yobo 3m beckford 3.5m and the sale of vaughan buy defoe

What would selling Beckford achieve?, he's our only reliable striker AND I can guarantee we wouldn't even use the money... Beckford is a NO NO

GP {Ed025's Note - your right g p..

Vicente is a free agent, isn't he?

Yes he is.

GP

17 Aug 2011 15:02:18
At the start of last season Sir Whisky Nose tipped us to be the suprise package...Nothing has changed, apart from the fact all of our players have a years more experience in the premier league. I think we will be up there at the end of the season even if we dont sign anyone Lets get behind the boys on saturday and try an be the 12th man so we get a good start this season.

We also have barkley, gueye and velios coming through and i believe beckford and coleman will be even better this season. COYB

17 Aug 2011 14:04:05
Michael Owen on loan anyone? Not a rumour just a thought...

He is part of united plans and we don't need an injury prone player

Owen is past his best, i would love us to get defoe

17 Aug 2011 13:02:19
Do you know if Moyes still has an interest in Jelle Vossen? Seems a decent young striker and may be worth a punt at a price we can afford.

Things have gone quiet on vossen, seems a good player and a realistic target.